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December 09, 2007

Comments

John-Julian, OJN

David:

Thank you: excellent clarity and spot on conclusions - with a minimum of rant.

It is going to be very difficult to hold one's breath for this space of time before TEC can take its canonical actions and clarify the muddy ecclesiastical landscape. (I believe that canonically +Schofield will have two months to recant.....it is going to seem like two decades to the poor Episcopalians in San Joaquin who don't know where to turn.)

And I do hope that the clergy (especially the young ones) who used to be in the Episcopal Diocese of San Joaquin (and are now in the diocese of...what?... Schofieldania?) will find the pension plan and medical coverage in the Province of the Southern Cone adequate and sufficient for themselves and their families. My hunch is that there will be a number of returnees when (excuse the mixed metaphors) the reality on the ground finally hits them between the eyes.

Peter Hall

Your comments on this blog are very interesting! especially comments about
"clergy to feel justified in their violation of their ordination vows that they will be "loyal to the doctrine, discipline, and worship of Christ as this Church has received them." The honourable course would be to renounce their vows, since they are no longer loyal to the doctrine and discipline of Christ"

If you look at the last line of the quote it is more the case that anyone who openly defies the scriptures ie homosexuality should be the ones to denounce their vows.

toujoursdan

If you look at the last line of the quote it is more the case that anyone who openly defies the scriptures ie homosexuality should be the ones to denounce their vows.

As you no doubt know, there is hardly unanimity in the church ecumenical (as well as Jewish circles) on what the Scriptures say about monogamous homosexual relationships. Biblical scholars in all major denominations - Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox - have looked at the "clobber verses" in their historical and cultural context and come to differing conclusions. Books that deal with the subject have been published over the past 40 years and can be found in most major bookstores.

FrDavid

The point is, "as this Church has received them." General Convention determines what the doctrine, discipline and Worship of the Episcopal Church constitute, and it has always been so. If you disagree with General Convention and cannot by conscience remain a "loyal dissenter," then the only honorable course is renunciation.

To claim that your interpretation as a presbyter or bishop is more correct than the mind of the entire church, that you represent the "true" strain of Anglicanism, and that you then have the right to break apart the Body of Christ because having people of an opposing viewpoint in the same church makes you uncomfortable is pure hubris.

Ordination vows are very specific. They are as much "for better or for worse" as the marriage ones. If you are no longer a minister in the Episcopal church, you should renounce your vows. It's not a matter of doctrine, it's a matter of discipline.

David+

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